Chalkhills Digest Volume 6, Issue 99
Date: Thursday, 4 May 2000
Chalkhills Digest, Volume 6, Number 99
Thursday, 4 May 2000
Topics:
Well?
New Sugarplastic record & mailgroup
english roundabout
In this Nude Ark Age
Waspy Charting
airplay in L.A.
Influence and brilliance and statues
Free XTC 3 song single with puchase of Wasp Star at HMV
Surprises
monaco
One toe in the Poison pool
Re: Wasp Star Launch Party
Bit of spoiling, bit of gloating
oh god, i remember...
My personal reply
Moulding Solo Album Please.
First Heavy Metal Record
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... to the Charleston shore, just as the moon rose over the bay.
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 10:20:09 -0700 (PDT) From: travis schulz <xtcisadarngoodband@yahoo.com> Subject: Well? Message-ID: <20000503172009.5290.qmail@web1104.mail.yahoo.com> Hello Chalkies! I've asked this question about four times, with nary an answer, but here I go again. Has ANYONE recieved their last Little Express? I haven't heard anyone discuss it here at all. Thank ya!
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:20:25 -0700 From: "Drew MacDonald" <drewmacdonald@mediaone.net> Subject: New Sugarplastic record & mailgroup Message-ID: <004201bfb52c$40929540$ac841818@we.mediaone.net> Sorry if someone has already posted this, but I know there are plenty of Sugarplastic fans on Chalkhills who will be very glad to know that the new CD, titled RESIN , is finally here! The band released it themselves. The cover art features the famous Magritte painting "Ceci N'est Pas Une Pipe," so it will be easy to spot in the record store. As of this morning, the only store carrying it is Aron's Records here in Los Angeles, though the band is working on getting wider distribution. Meanwhile, RESIN is available for worldwide mail order at www.aronsrecords.com for credit card users. U.S. residents who would rather use a cashier's check or money order can send it to Escape Artist Recordings 7048 Mammoth Ave. Van Nuys, CA 91405 Cost is $13 plus $3 for domestic shipping (CA residents add $1 for sales tax) Though the band is still working to set up an official website, fans can join the Spastic Laughter mailgroup at http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Spastic-Laughter Well, the four years since Sugarplastics' last record BANG THE EARTH IS ROUND wasn't quite as long as the wait between NONSUCH and AV1, but the S'plastics DID manage to beat WASP STAR to market by 20 days! Drew
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 19:58:34 +0100 From: "chris browning" <chris@boodle.fsnet.co.uk> Subject: english roundabout Message-ID: <010301bfb538$99b5fca0$533c893e@pbncomputer> heck people... i have just come back from a flying trip to swindon, to be inducted to a company i - ironically - soon will be quitting from as it turns out. never mind. at least the tortuous journey meant i got to see *the* town, giving me an enthusiasm my fellow inductee and driver could not understand. i have been thinking about this and no other location is so solidly connected with a band i love as much as swindon and XTC. i may yearn to see dunedin because of the origins of flying nun, and tanworth-in-arden for nick drake but this is different. swindon is where it all started, where it all grew from, where it continues to come from. wow. abiding thoughts - red brick houses! yay! old town - where the office is based - being on the GO 2 map and looking decidedly bohemian with it's arts cinema with big poster for "life of brian" outside. and - well - english roundabout. well let me just say, once you see "the magic roundabout" never will an XTC song make as much sense. it is an insane, lunatic thing. swindon is fairly much - as far as i could see - the centre of all roundabouts and there, stuck in the middle is the uber-white knuckle of them all. paul, my driver, was stressed out of his skull, not helped surely by my rapt enjoyment of the whole thing... so all in all, slightly briefer than i woudl have liked, but still - wow! i have been in teh place where genius lives, i have walked streets they have walked. pretty astonishing... anyway enough rambling crisp
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 15:58:04 EDT From: Hbsherwood@aol.com Subject: In this Nude Ark Age Message-ID: <cc.41009a3.2641decc@aol.com> >From: WESnLES@aol.com >Subject: SPOIL...got the real one...SPOIL > >I got the "real-final-product" disc in the mail from TVT yesterday. It >doesn't much differ from the promo dealio___but it does contain lyrics >and a nifty photo of the lads, as well as liner notes which thank June >and Pete Dix___Little Express___as well as some chap named John Relph. Well, isn't this cool! Relph, who's probably sold more records for XTC than anyone, who nearly single-handedly kept the Flame burning during the Wilderness Years, finally gets the recognition he deserves! I've never met Andy or Colin, but I had it in the back of my mind that if the occasion should arise I would indulge a little ear-chewing on the subject of their near-complete ignoring of (and occasional ungracious jeering at) the Chalkhills web site. Congratulations, John. Not only do you rock, but you also stone, pebble, and boulder--the last in river, shore, and glacial form. No schist, man, you deserve it. But Wes can, with one glance at that lyric sheet he's waving around, clear up a point of contention between Relph and me that has occasioned many an impatient e-mail and irritated response. (Well, *one* email and one response, but it's the principle of the thing...) Wes: In the song "In Another Life," is Colin singing "It's how we built love"; "It's how we're built, love"; or "It's how I built love"? I won't tell you which is my candidate and which is Wrong, but I predict your answer will cause Relph to drown his sorrows tonight in vats of wine while pondering ruefully the depths of his pigheadedness, and how best to compose his teary apology to me, which may or may not be accepted depending on the sufficiency of its groveling. ------ >From: "Duncan Kimball" <dunks58@hotmail.com> >Subject: Sacrelicious! > >- I think "Church Of Women" should have been the closing track. > >Am I crazy? > >Dunks > > [ Yes, you are crazy. -- John ] ...But at least John and I agree on one thing. "The Wheel and the Maypole" is the summer-upper, man! The Valediction! The Song of Life that balances the Song of Death that ends Apple Venus 1! The Eternal Boy-Girl song, starring Istar/Eostre/Astarte/the BVM in the siren role and featuring Andy's Axis Mundi (recently memorably described in this forum as "oozing"), the World Tree Yggdrasil, which *Odin climbed*...you get the (blue) picture. The Maypole looks like the Ultimate Pink Thing, of course: but look a little more carefully at it and the illusion begins to fray. "The ties that bind you will unwind to free me one day/And everything decays..." Isn't this a *renunciation* rather than an affirmation? The song recognizes that the Maypole--if you will, the Male principle--is a false idol, that all the erections men put up (in every sense of the word, from "pyramids and palaces" to the old purple-knob-on-a-blue-veiner), are Illusory in the Buddhist sense, born of desire and doomed to failure. Church of Women is unbalanced: There's no resolution, no conclusion, none of the emotionally satisfying acceptance of equivalency between the sexes (and thus between the Male and Female principles), that The Wheel and the Maypole evinces. The latter song is simply perfect to end not only Wasp Star but also the whole Apple Venus cycle--Yin and Yang in balance, union achieved, the lovers cradled asleep in each others' arms, the ovum lovingly embracing the seed to form a new life...and yes I said yes I will Yes... I love the interplay of archetypal shapes in this one: The straight line as Male and the circle as Female. Very nice, very chewy, very Yoo-hoo-hooongian.... ----- Herne, I don't condemn tape trading, collecting rarities, or anything of the sort. It would be unspeakably hypocritical of me to do any such thing. (Although people who know me can attest that I do stay away from demos of unreleased songs, because I think it's rude to look over somebody's shoulder while they're working. After the songs are released I'm happy to crawl over any amount of broken glass to get the demos.) My condemnation of Napster arises out of its abuse as a conduit to disseminate commercially released songs while depriving artists of payment. The sorts of things that tape traders collect just don't fall into this category. Also there's a huge magnification of scale of when you involve the Internet to commit piracy. Millions, not thousands. One observation has occurred to me during the course of this debate. My ISP also happens to be my employer, and I'm at the moment engaged in designing a major update of their Music channel, to take advantage of recent, er, "leveraged synergies" that you may have read about. The system we're designing is, like all the other music-purchasing/downloading systems we've seen so far, highly song-centric. It stands to reason: In this age of limited bandwidth, when it takes eons to download a single 5-MB MP3 file over a 56K modem, people are going to be much more interested in singles than albums. From where I'm sitting I can't help but foresee a future where the Album as we know it--45-70 minutes of collected songs in one package, with accompanying art and text that establishes a mood, its song sequence controlled by the artists and producers--is considered a quaint relic of the halcyon Twentieth Century. The combination of limited bandwidth for delivery and the ever-increasing availability of downloading and client-based media-writing--to CD-R or Rio-like devices or what-have-you--will make the Album an economic dinosaur. What will this mean for artists? The implications are bewildering. ----- Hope your leg's feeling better, Molly! ----- Duncan Watt has six-pack abs and testicles the size of young cantaloupes. Harrison "And an Axis Mundi to match" Sherwood
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 16:49:04 -0400
From: Ben Gott/Loquacious Music <gott@tmbg.org>
Subject: Waspy Charting
Message-ID: <B53608FF.21EB%gott@tmbg.org>
Keeds,
"Wasp Star" is #14 on Amazon.com's "Hottest Future Releases" chart, which
was updated today! Yee hah!
Any Vancouverians ever heard the Pepper Sands? Their song "So Fine" is
kickin'. Check them out at http://www.mp3.com/peppersands (unless you think
that, somehow, this will spoil your appreciation of "Wasp Star").
I just bought the digitally remastered "Zenyatta Mondatta," and am really
groovin' on Stewart's drumming which totally, utterly, and completely stands
out with the new digital sheen. In fact, all of The Police stuff has gotten
digitally remastered, and it's all "Nice Price" -- so, go! Get it!
-Ben
+-----------------------------------------------------------------+
Benjamin Gott . Loquacious Music . Brunswick, ME 04011
AIM: Plan4Nigel . Tel: (207) 721-5366 . http://listen.to/loquacious
You can feel it all over / You can feel it all over, people...
+-----------------------------------------------------------------+
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:11:17 EDT From: Robeach11@aol.com Subject: airplay in L.A. Message-ID: <25.52ff2f7.2641eff5@aol.com> "The Man Who Murdered Love" has been added to the 103.1 playlist here in Los Angeles. Sure sounds good in the car! A few issues ago, I took Dunks to task for his seemingly mean-spirited posts. Well, he sent me a very nice e-mail. I guess I just misinterpreted his Aussie sense of funnin' around. Props to Dunks. Rob Carson, Ca
------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 00:21:46 +0200 (MET DST) From: Hans_Stromberg <hansstromberg@spray.se> Subject: Influence and brilliance and statues Message-ID: <22135709@spray.se> Allo, allo. Paul Rogers wrote: <<I heard the new XTC single on the radio here last night. "I'm the man who killed love". Now first I have to say I am one of the most rabid XTC fans alive (since 1980 when I heard Black Sea). XTC is the most influential and inventive band since the Beatles. In fact they kind of are my beatles. That said, with all due respect, the new single is less than inventive. Thats being kind. It has a bloated "old rocker" feel to me. As clever as the lyric may be, it isn't married to the usual groundbreaking musicality. I'm hoping for more from the rest of the record. Please>> 1. I'm not so sure about xtc being especially influential at all (but yes, inventive), or that this has got something to do with their marvellous records. Just because a band is influential it doesn't mean that they're automatically good. I think xtc has been as influential on other bands as (which is a better comparison than The Beatles:) The Kinks were in their time; not very much at all. Anyway, I don't think that xtc has, in your word,s ever been into "groundbraking musicality". This concept applies more to bands like Suicide, The Silver Apples, Kraftwerk, The Velvet Underground or the early Residents, but not to Partridge and co. Instead, The Kinks and xtc make original and extraordinarily great pop music. 2. Of course, the man in question murdered love (and that sounds a whole lot better too). Roger: You just have to listen to it again and again - it's getting better every time! 4. Wasp star is absolutely brilliant. 5. "Statue of Liberty" (the first single from 1977) is xtc's most underrated song, IMO. And it's never even mentioned in here. Strange. And it's statues in this one also. Greetings from the North Pole, and, May The Fourth Be With You. Hans hansstromberg@spray.se hans.stromberg@dn.se
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:32:43 -0700 (PDT) From: relph (John Relph) Subject: Free XTC 3 song single with puchase of Wasp Star at HMV Message-ID: <10005031732.ZM154957@mando.engr.sgi.com> Just saw this on the Jangly list... -- John --- Forwarded mail from trevor.millett@umusic.com Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 17:37:24 -0000 Subject: Free XTC 3 song single with puchase of Wasp Star at HMV XTC is HMV's artist of the month (http://www.hmv.com/). They have a great interview on there site plus an offer for a free 3 song single if you pre-order the album. Check it out. The single has The Man Who Murdered Love (Album version) plus a home demo of the song. It also includes a home demo versoin of the song "Don't Hurt A Bit"
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:03:23 EDT From: WWi8064839@aol.com Subject: Surprises Message-ID: <68.32cc1c9.2642265b@aol.com> I'm so glad that I *haven't* been listening to any demos from the new XTC album. I want to be totally surprised when I finally get my copy! Life needs more surprises of the pleasant variety, n'est-ce pas? Those who say they hate it, maybe hold off on bringing it into a swapshop or selling it on E-Bay? You may find that, down the road, it will offer unexpected treasures. After all, didn't it take a while for "Harvest Festival" to emerge as one of the brighter moments on AV V1? I hadn't really noticed this song until John Relph posted a message about some of its nuances. I listened, and said "Yeah, this quiet song is a gem from a mature artist." A few nights ago I took out my gold Mobile Hi-Fi "Skylarking" and had a great time listening to it. I don't listen to XTC as much as I used to, but coming back to Skylarking, especially the gold disc, was a treat. I noticed how superior the gold disc is to my other versions of the album. (Check out the effect on Colin's vocals at the end of "Big Day." Wow, psychedelic man! I can see how this song, written for The Dukes but deemed "too good" and "better as an XTC song," is psychedelic all right, but I wonder if Colin changed the lyrics for Skylarking to fit in with Rundgren's "theme"?) I'm trying to get a gold disc of The Jam's "All Mod Cons/Sound Affects." (Both BRILLIANT albums worth hunting down, gang!) Anyway, I'm glad there's a new XTC release to look forward to. I'm hoping that other artists like Teenage Fanclub and Eric Matthews soon follow suit. By the way, what a waste of pretty design and packaging on Matthew Sweet's new one. The first three or four songs are brilliant and Spectoresque, then a puzzling decline and thematic departure takes place. It's hard to believe the same guy wrote all of the songs. Wes Wilson (www.quisp.com) :-)
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:58:11 -0700 From: "Wes Hanks" <wes@iolvegas.com> Subject: monaco Message-ID: <000701bfb56c$3a410ba0$1cb59fce@default> Is 'Complicated Game' metal? One could draw that conclusion. Professor Dom? Executing bootlegger power glide 180 degree dust spewing turn... I am looking for a copy of "Music for Pleasure" by Monaco for a friend. Its apparently either import-only and/or out-of-print. Please help, won't we? Off line of course. Wes "Mr. T is making commercials for Nevada Title Loans- 'You don't have to pawn your gold!' " Hanks
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:48:55 -0400 From: Karl Witter <chaff62@juno.com> Subject: One toe in the Poison pool Message-ID: <20000503.214900.162.1.chaff62@juno.com> >>Poison & Def Leppard are power pop >Now I'm sure we discussed "power pop" before on Chalkhills, and it >had cock all to do with Poodle Rock (to give the genre its correct >title) but I think I know what you mean. Really opening myself up here: Didja ever notice that every hair band (as I calls 'em) has one good recording or catchy ditty which stands out among the rest of their flotsam? Examples on request. Oh yes: Hey I'm back, note the new e-mail, did you miss me, of course not, no offense (am I, a Yank, allowed to say offence? I am a fan of soccer and Canadian football). Real men eat Wheat, Karl
------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:06:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Tyler Hewitt <tahewitt@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Wasp Star Launch Party Message-ID: <20000504040621.15755.qmail@web2101.mail.yahoo.com> re: Wasp Star Launch Party Date: Saturday May 27th 2000 Place: my home, Nieuwegein, Holland This sounds like a lot of fun, and I'd consider flying over if I wasn't already double....no, make that TRIPLE booked already with activities that weekend. I'll expect a full report afterwards. Tyler
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 23:58:02 -0400
From: "Carl" <carl@laprack.com>
Subject: Bit of spoiling, bit of gloating
Message-ID: <NDBBKJBCELGEDOFJCKHGMEABCAAA.carl@laprack.com>
Hi all-
Ahhh.Good to be back. I had to walk around my town's streets with
a big red letter 'N' painted on my chest (Montreal is a BIG town), but I've
paid my dues and I'm back.
I have to admit, I'm getting used to Wasp Star, although I listen
to it like I'm walking through a mine field- always careful to avoid all of
Colin's songs, and "Wounded Horse". I have to agree with whoever said that
"Church Of Women" should have been the closing track on the album. It is by
FAR the best song on this album, and that's just one man's opinion! The
beginning guitar part with Andy's vocals remind me of McCartney's "Ram On".
I just pre-ordered two copies of Wasp Star at HMV.com, and as a
gift for pre-ordering, I get a bonus CD with "I'm the man who murdered love"
studio and demo versions, as well as the "Didn't Hurt A Bit" demo. All I can
say is YAAAHHHOOO!!
-Carl
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:13:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tyler Hewitt <tahewitt@yahoo.com>
Subject: oh god, i remember...
Message-ID: <20000504041321.16382.qmail@web2101.mail.yahoo.com>
This thread about alt country that's starting up (and
that I contributed to)--
We had the same damn thread a few months ago! I
remember someone claiming that "Shake You Donkey Up"
was a country song!
So, um, lets think of a distraction, fast...
I know, what do you think is a great lost band or
album? One that is really good, and should have been
huge, but somehow didn't make it? It should be one
that's fairly obscure.
Got any good ones? I'll post mine later, my partner is
trying to get me off the computer so he can check his
mail.
Tyler
"Hello, I'm Johnny Cash"
-Johnny Cash
------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 03:43:39 EDT From: KINGSTUNES@aol.com Subject: My personal reply Message-ID: <a6.3dca5e5.2642842b@aol.com> DEAR SIR - READ ON; I'M IN CAPS. Tom "Tom" Kingston shared a few home truths...and some bollocks. >>Heavy metal truly starts with Black Sabbath. THEY WERE THE TRUE BEGINNING OF THE SOUND. YOU COULD MAKE NUMEROUS CASES ON EARLIER ARTISTS. HOW ABOUT BLUE CHEER, YOUNGSTER? BUT I HEAR THAT "METAL'' SOUND STARTING WITH B. S. AND I HEARD EVERYTHING BEFORE, AS IT HAPPENED. CAPICE? DON'T FORGET THE TERM WAS COINED IN A STEPPENWOLF SONG. CHECK YOUR LOCAL BIKER GROUP. In one sense, yes. In another, no. It really starts with "You Really Got Me" by The Kinks, 1965 RIGHT? NICE TRY, BUT NO CIGAR. THE KINKS MEARLY PUT A POP FACE ON NASCENT HARD ROCK, THE ANCESTOR OF METAL. THE METAL SOUND WAS STILL YEARS AWAY, AND REPRESENTED A BUDDING FRAGMENT OF THE HARD ROCK STYLE OF THE LATE 60'S. BESIDES, THE KINKS WENT ON TO BE REGARGDED MORE IMPORTANTLY AS POP/ROCK SONGWRITERS HISTORICALLY. but I can already hear the sound of violent, horrified flatulence from certain Kinks-loving contributors, CALL IT WHAT YOU WANT, BUT YOU'RE WRONG. THEN AGAIN, WE COULD TRACE THIS WHOLE MESS TO MISSISSIPPI DELTA BLUES. ASK MESSERS PAGE, CLAPTON, BECK, HENDRIX, MAYALL...... so I'll move quickly on. Snigger. >>Zep was NOT metal - they were too ecclectic and too good and too early. Too eclectic? Possibly. ABSOLUTELY. METAL, UP TO THE PRESENT, IS LIMITED BY NARROW MUSICAL CONSTRAINTS AND TASTES. THE VARIETY OF STYLES EXHIBITED BY ZEP IN ANY GIVEN ALBUM IS FAR BEYOND ANY BONAFIED METAL ALBUM. ALSO, REMEMBER THAT ALL MY COMMENTS ARE SEATED IN EXPERIENCIAL HISTORY. THERE WASN'T ANY ACKNOWLDEGED GENRE CALLED 'HEAVY METAL' TROUGHOUT THE SIXTIES AND WELL INTO THE SEVENTIES. THERE WAS THE ANTIQUATED HABIT OF REFERRING TO CERTAIN RECORDINGS OF 'HARD ROCK' GROUPS (AS THEY WERE CALLED THEN) "HEAVY". JIMMY PAGE LAID DOWN THE FUZZ GUITAR TRACK ON DONOVAN'S HURDY GURDY MAN IN 1968, MORE THAN OFTEN REFERRED TO AS "HEAVY" A THE TIME. WAS IT METAL? LIKE OZZY AND IRON MAIDEN AND METALLICA? HOW ABOUT CREAM? They certainly made a variety of tunes and albums, some fantastic and some utterly dire. I suppose technically you could call that eclectic...Too good? Fuck off! Bloody revisionist music fans CHEAP SHOT - MEANS NOTHING. MUSICALLY OVERALL THEY WERE MUCH BETTER THAN METAL GROUPS. Most of today's best Metal bands could wipe the floor with Led Zep. Jimmy Page was, and is, a great guitarist, but he's no Hendrix and there are countless more gifted and innovative players around now. YOU'RE MISSING THE POINT. A COMPARISON: BILLY COBHAM COULD WIPE THE FLOOR WITH RINGO STARR. HOW MANY MAHUVISHNU ALBUMS VRS. BEATLES ALBUMS DO YOU HAVE? WHO HAD A BIGGER INFLUENCE ON MUISC HISTORY? THE ARGUMENT IS OVERALL MUSICIANSHIP. SONGWRITING AND ARRANGEMENT. ALL THINGS IN CONTEXT TO SERVE THE END PRODUCT, THE RECORDING. ALSO, YOU MAKE THE MISTAKE OF TAKING ZEP OUT OF CONTEXT OF THEIR TIME. WHEN THE WERE BIG, THEY WERE AS GIFTED AND INNOVATIVE AS ANYONE OF THEIR TIME. WOULD YOU CRUCIFY HAYDN BECAUSE HE DIDN'T WRITE A SYMPHONY LIKE MOZART'S? DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT MOZART WOULD NOT HAVE WRITTEN WHAT HE DID WITHOUT THE INNOVATIONS OF HAYDN TO BUILD ON? BETTER YET, COMPARE ELVIS WITH LED ZEPPLIN. ALSO - THERE WAS NO ONE LIKE HENDRIX. Ooh, contentious! Well I'm the goddamn expert so tough poo! Finally, too early? Hmmm, a slightly wayward approach to musical history but close enough I suppose. DON'T SUPPOSE. KNOW YOUR FACTS. ZEP APPEARD YEARS BEFORE THE EMERGENCE OF METAL. >>Poison & Def Leppard are power pop Now I'm sure we discussed "power pop" before on Chalkhills, and it had cock all to do with Poodle Rock (to give the genre its correct title) but I think I know what you mean. I MISSED ALL THAT. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE? >>I wouldn't even call ACDC or KISS metal, although KISS had the look. They're both Metal bands, as any self-respecting Metal fan would tell you. WHAT CONSTITUTES A SRMF? WHAT CONSTITUTES THE MUSIC? I HAVE ALREADY ASKED SEVERAL MUSICIANS TODAY (I WAS AT A MUSIC STORE OFFICE PARTY TONIGHT) WHETHER THEY THOUGHT KISS WAS METAL OR NOT. THEY ALL AGREED THEY WERE NOT METAL. ONE GUY WAS ADAMANT. HE WAS WEARING A SLAYER T-SHIRT. Admittedly, you can always be pedantic about these things and say "they're not heavy enough" or "they're too melodic" or whatever, but Metal (like jazz, hip hop and blues) is a culture as well as a musical form and those bands are most definitely part of it. OK!!!!!! HERE, THEN IS THE REAL QUESTION! WHAT IS HEAVY METAL? WHAT DEFINES IT? IT HAS TO HAVE CLEARLY DEFINED FEATURES; OTHERWISE IT LOOSES IDENTITY. I WILL OPENLY ADMIT THAT I AM NOT A FAN OF WHAT I UNDERSTAND TO BE METAL. I AM BIASED. BUT FROM EXPOSURE TO IT I HAVE NOTICED THAT IT IS MORE NARROWLY DEFINED, SONICALLY, THAT MOST GENRES, AND DOES NOT LEND ITSELF TO EXPLORATIVE VARIETY (AKA, ECLETCICISM), AT LEAST NOWHERE NEAR THE LEVEL EMPLOYED BY OTHER GENRES. I KNOW THERE HAVE BEEN ATTEMPTS, BUT THEY SOUND STILTED AND HAVE A TENDENCY TO CANCEL OUT THE ESSENCE OF THE 'METAL' SOUND. ISN'T THAT WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE LAST METALLICA ALBUM? METAL TO ME, WHILE NOT SIMPLE TO DESCRIBE IN WORDS, IS INSTANTLY IDENTIFIABLE WHEN HEARD. I'M SORRY, BUT KISS AND ACDC DON'T REALLY FIT THE BILL. THEY ARE HARD ROCK, BUT NOT TRUE METAL. WHAT TO YOU IS TRUE METAL? >>Metallica is the first commercial success of the marriage of speed punk with metal Firstly, no it isn't. Motorhead. OK MOTORHEAD. BUT WHO HAS SOLD MORE ALBUMS AND HELPED DEFINE THE GENRE IN THE OVERALL MUSICAL LANDSCAPE? I rest my case. Secondly, there's no such thing as "speed punk". There's punk rock and there's hardcore. EXCUSE ME. I MEANT HARD CORE. BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I MEANT. Consult your local venue for details. SORRY - THEY ALL CLOSED ABOUT 15 YEARS AGO. I PLAYED AT SOME. THANK YOU FOR CLARIFIYING WHAT WE WERE DOING. >>Their songwriting was simply too pop and too superior to associate with metal. Oh dear oh dear...welcome to the world of abject fuckwittery! Yes, XTC are fantastic - that is, after all, why we are here - but that kind of pointless snobbery I WAS NOT BEING SNOBBISH. is just totally unhelpful TO WHAT? and, frankly, dishonest. I AM NOTHING BUT HONEST HERE. I AM PASSIONATE TO MY BONES! Too superior? EXCUSE ME. JUST SUPERIOR. Firstly, something cannot be too superior - it either is superior or it is not. Secondly, how do you guage these things? Is there some brilliant system that no one has told me about for working out levels of artistic value? YES., MUSICAL COMMON SENSE. IT REQUIRES AN UNDERSTANDING AND APPRECITATION FOR ALL OF MUSIC, HOWEVER. I SHOULD BE CONSIDERED SNOBBISH BECAUSE I HAVE ACCEPTED THE CHALLENGE OF COMPLETE MUSICAL APPRECIATION? BECAUSE MY FUCKING BLUE COLLAR BLOOD, SWEAT AND TEARS ARE IN MY PROFESSION AND MY OBSERVATIONS AND OPINIONS? MY LIFE'S WORK? SNOBBERY? WATCH YOUR STEP, SONNY JIM. YOU AND I ARE BOTH MERE SUBJECTS AND NOT ROYALTY IN THIS FIEFDOM, BUT I HAVE PAID MY DUES FOR MY KNOWLEDGE. I HAVE AN OUNCE OF PAIN AND A POUND OF LOVE, OVER 30 YEARS OF MUSICAL LOVE, BEHIND EVERY WORD I POST HERE. SNOBBERY IS NOT AN OPTION. Opinions are one thing (and I'm full of 'em, or rather it, as you know) but there is absolutely no analytical basis for saying that one style of songwriting is inherently superior to another, STYLE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH GREAT SONGWRITING. I WAS MAKING THE POINT THAT XTC BROKE THROUGH ON A WAVE OF STYLE, ONLY TO EVENTUALLY ESCHEW IT TO FOLLOW THEIR BLISS. HOWEVER, GREAT SONGWRITING WILL ATTRACT A WIDER AUDIENCE. METAL, ON THE WHOLE (BECAUSE OF IT'S DIFFICULT AESTHETIC) EXCLUDES MORE THAN IT INCLUDES, THEREFOR IT DOES NOT APPEAL TO SONGWRITERS OF A HIGHER CALIBER. THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT THERE AREN'T EXCELLENT SONGWRITERS WHOSE FIRST STYLISTIC GENRE IS METAL. BUT ANY HOPE OF A GREATER AUDIENCE ACCEPTANCE IS VERY LIMITED. except maybe in terms of success (i.e. despite sucking fat asses, the Spice Girls' writers are clearly succeeding in their attempts to appeal to teenage girls etc and are therefore "superior", in terms of audience size, to someone like Slayer). THE TRUE TEST IS THE COMBINATION OF POPULARITY AND TIME. DO NOT FORGET TIME. WHAT WILL REMAIN FOREVER WOVEN INTO THE FABRIC OF THE MUSICAL CONSCIOUSNESS OF HUMAN KIND? XTC's songs clearly have more impact with you than, say, Iron Maiden's OK EVERYONE - HUM A FEW BARS - C'MON! IRON MAIDEN? WHAT'S WITH YOU PEOPLE? ON THE COUNT OF THREE! (SORRY FOR BEING A SMARTASS). YET - YESTERDAY I PLUCKED OUT THE INTRO FOR SENSES WORKING OVERTIME, AND OUR OFFICE MANAGER, WHO DOES NOT OWN AN XTC ALBUM, RECOGNIZED IT! but superiority is in the eye of the cocksure beholder, is it not? AND I AM COCKSURE. Besides, there are many inspired and hugely talented songwriters in Metal WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY WASTING THEIR TIME IN METAL FOR? LOOKING FOR A BREAK THERE, LIKE XTC WAS LOOKING FOR ONE IN PUNK? I rather suspect that you haven't exactly been following the scene very closely! QUITE RIGHT. I HAVE TO LOVE IT TO WANT TO. GUESS WHAT; I DON'T. BUT I GET MY FAIR SHARE OF EXPOSURE THROUGH MY STUDENTS. Mind you, it's good to see someone expressing an intelligent view on the subject for a change. THANK YOU! YOU TOO!!!!!! It's certainly preferable to the usual "ha ha! look at the silly metal fans!" attitude which appears on the list sometimes...although I do quite enjoy it when people go out of their way to appear stupid, patronizing and pompous. It saves me from doing it anyway... >> I have recently taught a student a Green Day song. And they're considered old news! And rightly so. They were mildly interesting five years ago. Next! MY POINT EXACTLY. Hey, kids today aren't so bad after all! THEY NEVER WERE. IT'S ALL A CONTINUUM. Incidentally, is does make me laugh to hear people refer to Marilyn Manson and Korn as "new" acts...the ageing process can be cruel sometimes. ARE YOU PAST 40 YET? DON'T WORRY. YOU WILL BE SOMEDAY. GOD WILLING. Keep in touch, as they say...WILL DO! >>Just buy the goddamn CD when it comes out. OK? Why bother? I think I'll download it from Napster. Much more fun. Anyone want a free copy? MY POINT IS THE DEBATE IS REDICULOUS. SAME ONE THEY HAD ABOUT TAPES YEARS AGO. BUT WHY, OH WHY, WOULD YOU NOT SUPPORT XTC WITH YOUR $$$$$? IF YOU DOWNLOAD AND NOT PAY, YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO CALL YOURSELF AN XTC FAN. ALL OF YOU!!!!! YOU ARE DENYING A LIVING TO THE VERY THING THAT BRINGS YOU SUCH PLEASURE. I HAVE NEVER HESITATED TO PURCHASE ANYTHING THEY PUT OUT, KNOWING THAT, HOWEVER FUCKED UP THEIR SITUATION WITH THEIR COMPANY WAS, IT WAS THEIR SOURCE OF INCOME AND CONTIUANCE. ALL OF MY VINYLS AND CDS WERE PURCHASED WITHIN A MONTH OF THEIR RELEASES. I CONTRIBUTED TO THEIR WELLFARE AND TO THE FACT THAT THEY ARE STILL ABLE TO MAKE RECORDINGS. DO YOU THINK THAT IF THEIR FANS NEVER PAID THAT THEY WOULD BE AROUND TO HEAR ANYMORE? I'M SORRY, OF ALL THE THINGS MENTIONED ON THIS LIST, THAT ATTITUDE IS THE MOST WRONG. BUY THE CD. SUPPORT XTC. I DON'T CARE IF YOU TAPE, DOWNLOAD OR WHATEVER, BUT GIVE THEM SOME OF YOUR MONEY. PAY YOUR XTC BILL, PEOPLE. OTHERWISE, DON'T CALL YOURSEVES FANS. MUCH LOVE AND RESPECT, TOM 'THANK GOD I HAVE LIVED THIS LONG' KINGSTON Death to false metal! DEATH TO FALSE MUSIC!!!! TK Dom \m/
------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:28:00 +1000 From: "Tom Pitsis" <lentom@healey.com.au> Subject: Moulding Solo Album Please. Message-ID: <000f01bfb5bb$ceeb4460$2a4519cb@tom> Great carvings and mouldings as Mr Partridge's songs may be, I must say that Mr Moulding's songs are the choicest baked partridges there are. Now that you have your own label, please let Colin release a solo album in the not too distant galaxy far far away - or at least reverse the ratio for one album: A dozen mouldings, 3 or 4 Partridges. I've loved the moulding songs so much for so long, I'm tricking my brain into extending its blind music love to "Frivolous Tonight" - (a bitter tune to swallow).
------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 10:45:57 +0100 From: "Davies, Huw (TPE)" <Huw.Davies3@Wales.GSI.Gov.UK> Subject: First Heavy Metal Record Message-ID: <7209B69A281BD4119EE50001FA7EA975AEADCE@WOMAIL2> It was interesting to see Dom saying that "You Really Got Me" by the Kinks was the first Heavy Metal record as Jimmy Page is alleged to have played guitar on this track. Obviously, Dave Davies denies this. Some rock critics say that The Who started heavy metal and some even say that the Beatles' "Ticket to Ride" was the first heavy metal record. In the end, it is almost impossible to pinpoint where a particular genre of music started. Who was the first Punk band? What was the first Rock and Roll record? Should we care? XTC Content: Black Sabbath were a big influence on the young Colin Moulding. Huw Davies http://members.tripod.co.uk/davieshuw
------------------------------ End of Chalkhills Digest #6-99 ******************************
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