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Subject: Chalkhills Digest #8-48


          Chalkhills Digest, Volume 8, Number 48

                 Thursday, 22 August 2002

Topics:

                    trade, don't buy!
                      Re: Look Look!
                       to Jonny Pop
   A to Z (Darryl, Debunk... words with a D this time!)
         A Couple of Ramblings (one XTC related)
                Chalkhills Digest #8-47...
            A little something I picked up...
           tackling moby's mountain by strategy
         Drop a Nickel into the Celestial Jukebox
            The h band featuring Dave Gregory
                Dave on Tour with Hogarth
                  Echo & The Bandanamen
                 Re: Guitargonauts Upates
             Jellyfish box set - XTC mention

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On a walkway and moving fast.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2002 21:46:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tyler Hewitt <tahewitt@yahoo.com>
Subject: trade, don't buy!
Message-ID: <20020817044656.67353.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com>

Some posts recently concerning the A-Z boot, and Ebay,
etc.
My two cents:

Bootlegs CAN hurt artists financially. Maybe not much,
as I assume that nearly everyone who buys a bootleg
already owns a band's commercial releases.

But, why support bootleggers who are ripping off the
artists and the artist's record companies? Bootleggers
seem to piss off everyone concerned.
 There is a way to get to listen to rare tracks by
your favorite groups without buying bootlegs-Why not
trade?

Trading boots and live shows has grown pretty huge,
there are several internet sites out there where
people can post what they have and want to trade (my
favorite is the Tape Traders Network
http://www.tapetradernetwork.com/)

I can't vouch for all traders, but there generally
seems to be a kind of code of ethics among traders-no
trading legitimate in-print releases, no selling-trade
only, etc.

I've been trading myself since just after AV1 was
released. I took a little hand-held tape recorder to
Andy's cd signing at Border's in Chicago. All it took
was a post to Chalkhills, and I had several offers to
trade. Now, I have several hundred cdr's by dozens of
artists-too many to listen too!

All the trading has kept me too busy at times, but
it's mostly been fun. The good trades I've done have
more than made up for the occasional rip-off jerk or
anal-retentive asshole who insists on
commercial-quality sound and has a temper trantrum
when that's not what you send.

And, there's lots of XTC available out there in
trading circles. My collection of a few dozen demo
collections, live shows, interviews, etc. pales in
comparison to other lists I've seen. Some of these
people are Chalkhillers too, you know who you are!

By the way, I intend on removing any tracks from my
trade list that are on Fuzzy Warbles, once it is
released. I'd much rather A&C get the cash than trade
what will be commercially available music.

So, trade, don't buy bootlegs. Everyone seems much
happier that way, and it's fun.

Tyler

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2002 22:00:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Relph <relph@mando.engr.sgi.com>
Subject: Re: Look Look!
Message-ID: <10208162200.ZM262993@mando.engr.sgi.com>

"Jonny Pop" <jbkxtc@ev1.net> wrote:
>
>OH! Before I forget, I saw a CD today at Amoeba in the used XTC section that
>I'd never seen before.  It appeared to be some sort of cover collection by
>an author or something - who's name I've completely forgotten now, of
>course - and the song it listed by XTC was "Rocket".  The lyrics were all
>supposedly written by this guy who looked old on the photo on back.  With
>that minimal set of clues, can anyone fill me in and should I go back and
>get it (if someone on this list here in town doesn't go before I do)?

That's "Place of General Happiness: Lyrics by Ernest Noyes Brookings,
Vol. 2".  Here's the bare bones facts with none of the "interesting"
stuff.  He was an old guy in a rest home and he wrote poetry.  Andy
Partridge put music to the poem "Rocket", and it's a pretty cool
song.  There are some other cool songs on that CD, too, but there are
a couple of stinkers, too.  Still, overall it's pretty interesting.
Rubber Rodeo's "Planning and Completing an Explorative Trip to Planet
Mars" is pretty durn cool.

	-- John

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Aug 2002 23:29:04 +0100
From: "Darryl W. Bullock" <drol@btinternet.com>
Subject: to Jonny Pop
Message-ID: <001701c2463d$958891e0$19a2fea9@Bullock>

Jonny,

The disc you were asking about in the last Chalkhills digest is 'Place Of
General Happiness - Lyrics by Ernest Noyes Brookings, Volume 2'.

It came out in 1991 on ESD records and is now quite hard to find. I'd get
back to Amoeba and grab it if I were you.

The song 'Rocket', although credited to XTC is actually performed by Andy
solo and was recorded at home in the shed. The same version of the song also
appears on several XTC bootlegs, including the Extatic 'Nonsuch Demos' set,
'Andy Partridge A - Z' and the limited UK 2 disc 'Nonsuch' demos collection.

It's a wonderful performance, but quite a bizarre set of lyrics. Still, well
worth inclusion in any XTC collection.

Hope this helps,

Darryl.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Aug 2002 11:21:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Wes Long <optimismsflames@yahoo.com>
Subject: A to Z (Darryl, Debunk... words with a D this time!)
Message-ID: <20020817182139.50934.qmail@web14912.mail.yahoo.com>

I've known Darryl for some time now, and he's written
some nice bios of the band for my Optimism's Flames
site... so please don't view the following as an
attempt to shit-hammer him.  I just want to set the
record straight.

Darryl W. Bullock said:

"I hear that Andy and Colin, via Idea are very
carefully watching Ebay and other auction sites and
have managed to have several boots and other illegal
items withdrawn. Several people who have been trading
on Ebay for years have had their accounts suspended in
recent months so this would seem to be the case here."

Well - I'd be shocked if this were the case.  I don't
know about Colin, but Andy is *rarely* online.  Also,
not sure what you mean by "via Idea" here.  Anyone can
have an auction removed... I've done it myself on a
number of occasions.  There are many items that ebay
does not allow to be auctioned... including cdr's,
promo items and boots.  Ebay has no idea if these
things are being sold, unless someone reports it to
them.  Now... to have your account suspended you have
to have done something pretty bad.  There is a certain
Italian fellow who often bids on ebay, but rarely - if
ever - pays.  I had to go through hell to get him
removed. Of course, he just grabbed another email
address and jumped back into the fray.  *If* XTC had
some folks removed, then they deserved to be removed.
I very much doubt they went to this effort.

More Darryl:

"Shame, because until Idea get around to issuing Fuzzy
Warbles this is the only way that many of us rabid
fools (the same rabid fools who will go out
and buy the 'official' product anyway) have of
accessing this material."

True - if you're willing to part with $70 for a
bootleg (no guarantee of quality) of songs that will
very soon be released by the band themselves... you
are indeed a rabid fool, and will *most likely*
purchase the actual Fuzzy Warbles discs too.

I know you are approaching this from the "why should
Andy and Colin care" point of view... but I'm coming
at it from a different angle.  I'm much more
interested (as a rabid fan and trader of XTC boots) in
the chap who is selling the boots.

More Darryl:

"I understand totally that Andy and Colin have the
right to protect their material and also the right to
market the same in any way in which they see fit - but
they will never be able to take on the bootleggers
single handedly, and most of the people who deal in
XTC bootlegs are hardly in it for the money - almost
all of the new titles that have appeared over the last
few years have been put out in limited runs by fans
for trading purposes only."

I've spoken with Andy at length on this one... he
doesn't mind all the boots, and is very much flattered
by the notion that so many would go to such lengths to
acquire them.  What he *does not* like is the notion
of someone making money off the boots. As you said
Darryl - "most of the people who deal in XTC bootlegs
are hardly in it for the money" - and I would tend to
agree with this statement.  However - *none* of the
people who deal in XTC bootlegs should be selling them
on ebay!  If you do this, then you are most certainly
in it for the money.

DB:

"C'mon guys, do you really think that a handful of
people selling bootlegs is going to cripple you
financially?"

Of course they don't... As a rabid XTC fan you know
that this is one band that is most definitely *not* in
it for the money.  Would Andy like to see his albums
sell more?  Of course - but the motivation behind this
desire is certainly not money.

DB:

"Ease up, boys and get some new material out. Maybe
that way we wouldn't be desperately buying up anything
that we can lay our grubby little hands
on!"

Well - I certainly agree with you here... bring on the
new material!  No cause for the "ease up" bit
though... unless you want to stare into a mirror and
repeat it endlessly to yourself. ;)

wesLONG

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Aug 2002 16:15:47 -0400
From: "Molly, the New Wave Queen" <mollyfa0000@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: A Couple of Ramblings (one XTC related)
Message-ID: <000401c246f4$0cdd7600$2f00590c@vogmudet>
Organization: AT&T Worldnet

First of all to Brian, I buy CDs due to the MUSIC.  I don't hate mp3s, but I
rather hear them from the CD.  So sue me if I like the format.  I'll always
buy CDs (well, used or bargin ones at least, went to Virgin this past Friday
in Boston and I was blown away by the prices.  There ya go, Virgin being
stupid idiots again. :P).
I did buy two XTC CDs in the album cover format (the special issued CDs at
Borders (I know, I know I'm adding to the cooperate world, but I was
shopping with my sister, and I needed to finish my collection).  I got
"White Music" and "Go2".  I believe those were the last two CDs in the album
cover format.
Good thing to remember it's always good to go shopping for CDs with loved
ones.  :)

Molly

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2002 06:43:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Todd Bernhardt <beat_town@yahoo.com>
Subject: Chalkhills Digest #8-47...
Message-ID: <20020819134352.79430.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com>

...was a right short issue! Damn!

Brian Matthews said about file sharing:
> I don't know about everyone here, but I'd like to hear more of any given new
> album than what I can be spoonfed off the radio, laughable as that is.
> MP3s allow me to do that if I so desire. I'm not a music-swap junkie,
> thankfully. I just want to hear some more of the album before I go out and
> buy it.

Apparently, you ain't the only one. More fodder for this discussion:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/26710.html

 From there, you can click through to Forrester Research's site, which says
that the "labels are in trouble, and it's not from file sharing. To tap into
$2 billion in new revenues, they must let people find, copy, and pay for
music on their own terms."

Got an extra $495 laying around? You can get the full 12-page report. Only
...  $41.25 per page. Yow. Apparently I'm in the wrong business.

Darryl Bullock said:
> I hear that Andy and Colin, via Idea are very carefully watching Ebay and
> other auction sites and have managed to have several boots and other illegal
> items withdrawn. Several people who have been trading on Ebay for years have
> had their accounts suspended in recent months so this would seem to be the
> case here.
>
> Shame, because until Idea get around to issuing Fuzzy Warbles this is the
> only way that many of us rabid fools (the same rabid fools who will go out
> and buy the 'official' product anyway) have of accessing this material.

Not really. You can get it all from trading with other people ... that way,
no cash is exchanged, and no money made from the efforts of others.

> I understand totally that Andy and Colin have the right to protect their
> material and also the right to market the same in any way in which they see
> fit - but they will never be able to take on the bootleggers single
> handedly, and most of the people who deal in XTC bootlegs are hardly in it
> for the money - almost all of the new titles that have appeared over the
> last few years have been put out in limited runs by fans for trading
> purposes only.

It seems to me that people who market (i.e., sell) bootlegs *are* in fact in
it for the money! With digital technology, there is no such thing as a
"limited run" -- you can trade with other fans to your heart's content, with
no loss of audio quality from the original. But packaging and selling a
bootleg is, as I say above, profiting from others' efforts. And less than
ethical, IMO.

-Todd

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 08:55:33 +0100
From: GILES WARD <GILES@chalkward.com>
Subject: A little something I picked up...
Message-ID: <3D61F5F4.932D0DB9@CHALKWARD.COM>

Hi

I've just picked up this CD: Rock Over London #96/45 radio show from
November 1996. I'd never heard of it before, but it's amazing! If anyone
fancies trading for a copy I'm all ears...

It features Andy co-hosting and chatting to Dave Sexton about the
strike, collaborations, new songs etc etc... it includes the tracks
Wrapped In Grey; The Ugly Underneath; This Is Pop; Easter Theatre
(demo), Playground (demo); The Heads: Papersnow; Terry And The Lovemen:
The Good Things; Martin Newell: When The Damsons Are Down; Herbert
Groenemeyer: Lead Me Home; Harold Budd/Andy Partridge: Anima Mundi.

If anyone fancies a CDr copy of the show I'm quite happy making one. I'm
always looking for interesting things to trade. Interviews? rare tracks?
Let me know.

I've also got a copy of FMQB's Progressions 41, hosted by Colin
Moulding. Some great tracks, including I'd Like That. It's fascinating
hearing Colin chat about the tracks... again I'm quite happy to do a
copy for people!

If you're interested email me: giles@chalkward.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:13:14 +0000
From: "don device" <ddevice@hotmail.com>
Subject: tackling moby's mountain by strategy
Message-ID: <LAW2-F17ZU6JONLLjQo00007fad@hotmail.com>

chalkhellions,

not to open an old wound... but, oh hell, why not?

with all the sound and fury over moby, we seem to have overlooked several
assertions about the sound of his new song. To whit: does, or does it not
sound like xtc? as i recall someone posted a review claiming that it did and
also making 80's 'new wave' references.

for my two cents, the overwhelming influence would seem to be 'taking tiger
mountain by strategy'-era Eno... can't hear the xtc thing at all.. what
d'yer think?

don device

"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, its too
dark to read." -Groucho Marx

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 15:02:32 EDT
From: Hbsherwood@aol.com
Subject: Drop a Nickel into the Celestial Jukebox
Message-ID: <4a.104130ba.2a93ec48@aol.com>

>From: "Brian" <mattone@bhip.infi.net>
>Subject: Re: Clarifications & Congratulations
>
>Todd B. says:
>
>> In the context of Janis Ian's overall efforts, P2P music-file sharing
>> increases album sales.
>
>I can imagine why this would happen.
>I don't know about everyone here, but I'd like to hear more of any given
>new album than what I can be spoonfed off the radio, laughable as that is.
>MP3s allow me to do that if I so desire. I'm not a music-swap junkie,
>thankfully. I just want to hear some more of the album before I go out
>and buy it.

Just received a study from the Forrester Group, entitled "Downloads Save the
Music Business" (August 2002) that backs this up. I've uploaded the study at
http://members.aol.com/hbsherwood/DownloadsSavetheMusicBus.pdf. It's quite
fascinating.

>From the Executive Summary:

- Digital Music Users Say That They Won't Slacken CD
     Purchases

   Did piracy cause the slump? We surveyed 1,000 online consumers
   to find out. We found that people who use file-sharing typically
   also "rip" CDs to PC hard drives and burn music CDs, so we
   segmented them into four groups: Digital Music Lovers, Learners,
   Dabblers, and Nonusers. None plan to reduce CD buying by much
   (see Figure 1).

- Digital Music Lovers say they wonb
   Digital Music Lovers -- those who download, rip, or burn at least
   nine times per month -- are 5% of adults, but they buy 15% of all
   CDs. They plan to decrease CD buying by 2% in the next 12 months.
   In fact, while 13% say downloading will decrease their music
   purchases, 39% say exposure to new music online increases their
   CD buys.

- Digital Music Learners will remain the heart of the music market.

   One in seven adults is a Digital Music Learner who downloads, rips,
   or burns three to eight times per month. Learners buy 21% of all
   CDs; two-thirds say file sharing doesn't affect their CD purchases.
   More than half will increase their downloading, but if downloading
   becomes less convenient, 59%  say they'd slow down.

- Digital Music Dabblers and Nonusers buy the lionb
   One-quarter of adults are Dabblers who use digital music activities
   less than three times a month; 26% don't use digital music at all,
   and 32% aren't even online. These MP3 virgins and near-virgins still
   buy 64% of all the CDs sold in the US.

Based on this study and others like it Sony/Universal joint venture PressPlay
(http://pressplay.com/) two weeks ago revised its offering/price point to
include unlimited downloads and streams in its $14.99/mo. subscription
service ($9.99 the first three months).

Rival MusicNet (http://MusicNet.com), a partnership among AOL Time Warner,
Bertelsmann AG, and EMI Group, has similarly revised its offering to an
unlimited model. (Full Disclosure: I am intimately professionally involved
with the MusicNet on AOL product, and cheerfully admit to no objectivity
whatsoever.)

What all this means is that by the end of the year, hundreds of thousands of
tracks from the Big Five labels (plus whatever independents want to join)
will be available for download or stream for less than the cost of one CD per
month.. Download all you want, guilt-free. (Burning is still highly limited,
but the labels will come around.)

Janis Ian won't know what hit her.

Harrison "The Friday night charades of youth/were spent on one more
beautiful" Sherwood

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 08:31:48 +0100
From: "Simon Clarke" <Simon.Clarke1@ntlworld.com>
Subject: The h band featuring Dave Gregory
Message-ID: <000d01c248e4$d317f060$7c7ba8c0@simon>

> From: mark.strijbos@hccnet.nl
>
> You also might like to know about a string of H Band live
> gigs featuring Dr. Gregory throughout the UK & Holland:

Can I also add to this in case it hasn't already been mentioned that a h
band live album from the Agust 2001 gigs is now available from
http://www.marillion.com/discog/hlive/index.html  It features Mr G
throughout and includes a cracking version of 'The Loving'.

Cheers,

Simon

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 09:35:36 -0500
From: "Joe Funk" <twosheds@mindspring.com>
Subject: Dave on Tour with Hogarth
Message-ID: <00ce01c24920$03831aa0$dd26f318@austin.rr.com>

FYI for all of y'all in th UK:

THE H BAND ON TOUR
Featuring Steve Hogarth, Richard Barbieri, Andy Gangadeen, Dave
Gregory, Aziz Ibrahim, Jingles, Dalbir Singh, Stephanie Sobey-Jones

10 Sept Cardiff,
Wales Jumpin' Jaks Online: www.ticketweb.co.uk www.ticketmaster.co.uk
www.wayahead.com www.stargreen.co.uk

11 Sept Sheffield, England The Works, Sheffield Hallam University
Union of Students - MAP  In Person: The Works box office
By Phone: +44 (0)114 2254143

13 Sept Amsterdam, Netherlands Paradiso Online: www.ticketservice.nl
              Search for  h-band
By Phone: +31 (0)900 3001250
In Person: Major Post Offices, GWK,
Regular and Venue Box Offices

14 Sept Hellendoorn, Netherlands Bluescafe De Lantaarn

15 Sept London, England Dingwalls, Camden Online: www.ticketweb.co.uk
www.ticketmaster.co.uk www.wayahead.com www.stargreen.co.uk

Jomama
www.thirteenofeverything.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 10:05:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Wes Long <optimismsflames@yahoo.com>
Subject: Echo & The Bandanamen
Message-ID: <20020821170513.97414.qmail@web14911.mail.yahoo.com>

Short n sweet -

Need some Echo & The Bunnymen boots for a gift for a
dear friend.  Have loads of XTC boots to swap:
http://members.tripod.com/~The_Last_Balloon/

Anyone?

XTC content:

The Rag & Bone Buffet bandana:
http://www.optimismsflames.com/Bandana1.htm

wesLONG

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 12:17:27 +0000
From: "James McRae" <ijcmcrae@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Guitargonauts Upates
Message-ID: <F132nksMhG4YdlbEwPI00000bf2@hotmail.com>

Ta for the reminder.  I'm looking forward to toddling down to Camden...

Trawling around Marillion's site got me wondering if their recent
(favourable) experience with fan-financed album production might hold out
any prospects for a better payday for A&C?  I don't know how many hard core
fans there are out there, but I'd put up some quids towards their efforts up
front in return for a signed copy when the disc is ready.  Anyone got any
views?

James

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 13:03:17 -0400
From: Centerpond@aol.com
Subject: Jellyfish box set - XTC mention
Message-ID: <1A72C506.12A724AF.0ACBB7EA@aol.com>

Chalksters and Chalkettes;

I just got the brand new, hot-off-the-press Jellyfish box set called
"Fan Club".  Why should you be interested in this 4-CD release?  Well,
for one thing, they were a great band.  Their songs featured great pop
arrangements, super harmonies and melodies, and just enough of the
"Q-factor" (where Q = quirky) to delight the heart of almost any
member of this mailing list.  The set does not have any tracks from
their 2 studio releases (BELLYBUTTON and Spilt Milk), but rather
features a wealth of demos, live cuts and unreleased gems.

These guys readily admit to being heavily under the influence of XTC.
In fact, the band biography included in the set describes how the
author of the booklet met keyboardist/songwriter Roger Manning while
listening to an import copy of Skylarking soon after that album had
been released.  Also, original guitarist Jason Falkner was brought on
board because his trade paper ad listed XTC as an influence, which was
viewed as mandatory by Manning and Andy Sturmer
(drummer/songwriter/lead singer).

I got my copy of the box set by pre-ordering it from NotLame.com;  I
guess you can get it elsewhere but the NotLame folks are nice to do
business with (I've been buying from them for 7 years but have no
financial interest except for the many bucks they've gotten from me in
return for great products).

Mike

------------------------------

End of Chalkhills Digest #8-48
******************************

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