Precedence: bulk
Subject: Chalkhills Digest #6-270

         Chalkhills Digest, Volume 6, Number 270

                Sunday, 17 September 2000


                      Re: Sad songs
           " And if you covered him with ... "
                  sad songs say SO much
                    You Mean Alchemy?
                          Oops !
                    Wasp Star Bashing
                 if you were in my movie
                    Re: "Bonus" Tracks
             I'm the man who uttered pie trap
           RE: True Confession: Misheard Lyrics
                  (insert subject here)
           Re: Empty Garden and other sad songs
                     eBay Randomness
                       more mummery
                    The Big Flame-Off
                         A taker
                Here comes Vernal Equinox!
                        Bonus Onus


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    Chalkhills is compiled with Digest 3.7b (John Relph <>).

I'm locked in adult land.


Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2000 21:52:57 -0400
From: "Brian" <>
Subject: Re: Sad songs
Message-ID: <002501c01f81$4e9f9f60$1b0affd1@Brian>


Not perusing everyone's comments as deeply as I'd like, perhaps I missed
mention of this song, but one that always tugs at my emotions is Mike & The
Mechanics' "The Living Years".
Every time I hear that line toward the end "I can hear my father's echo in
my newborn babies' tears" it just tears me apart.
I think I ought to go call my Dad...

-Brian Matthews


Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 09:21:05 +0900
From: "John Boudreau" <>
Subject: " And if you covered him with ... "
Message-ID: <000901c01f88$9714a5e0$7e5791d2@johnboud>

garbage , George Sanders would still have style ... " ( Kinks - Everybody's
In Showbiz " ) ...

Congratulations to Debora Brown for being the first to provide the correct
answer to my trivia question . Yes , it was George Sanders in the classic
Academy Award winning 1950 film ( Best Film and Best Director )  " All About
Eve " , who uttered the lines ,  "To those of you who do not read, attend
the theater, listen to unsponsored radio programs or know anything of the
world in which you live, it is perhaps necessary to introduce myself . My
name is Addison DeWitt. My native habitat is the theater. In it I toil not,
neither do I spin. I am a critic and commentator. I am essential to the
theater -- as ants to a picnic, as the boll weevil to a cotton field."

Apparently there recently was an A & E " All About Eve " special , and this
contributed to my receiving many correct answers . Thanks to all who
participated .

 By the way , Debora will receive a year's supply of
Spam Luncheon Meat ( luncheon meat ? ) for her correct answer . Yum yum !!!



I bet you didn't know that Sanders was a trained singer who once signed to
sing in "South Pacific." Albums like "The George Sanders Touch" ("a worldly
touch -- a gentle caress one moment, a vise-like grasp in the next " ,
according to the liner notes) provided a crooning background for the '50s
maneuverings of would-be cads !


Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2000 21:08:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tyler Hewitt <>
Subject: sad songs say SO much
Message-ID: <>

okay, i'm getting pretty tired of the sad songs thread
(thanks to our precious gem for that one)
but, someone mentioned tom waits, so i'll add one
'christmas card from a hooker in minneapolis' is
pretty sad, although it dosent hit me the same way
that other sad songs do.

maybe an interesting variation would be songs that are
not particularly sad in themselves, but are sad by
association for us.
any takers?

on a completely unrelated note:
bought two cd's on their release day this week (the
first time I've bought a cd on release day since wasp
star), and they're both really good.

I wholeheartedly reccomend:

Los Lobos Del Este De Los Angeles (just another band
from east la)

emmylou harris-red dirt girl

the los lobos is a reissue of their first
(self-released) lp from 1977, and is all accoustic
traditional mexican songs.
the emmylou is her first studuo album in 5 years and
is similar in mood and texture to her wrecking ball cd.


Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 01:58:08 EDT
Subject: You Mean Alchemy?
Message-ID: <>

Chalkalkalkalkalkers -

Jes' thought I'd post my reply to Annmarie, seeing as I think I ecouraged her
to post her reply to my Great Fire ramblings.......

>Wow!  You make it so sexy!  Now I see.  Thing is that it just never floated
my boat >musically, so I never payed attention to the words.  You should have
posted that!  >Eloquent defence!

>You know, you also got me thinking what an orchestral tribute to XTC would
be >like......

>Human Alchemy is a scary sounding thing, though, isn't it?  Andy's bizarre
>volcalisms, the synth punches, and the Gregorian droning on the chorus over
that >wild, sparce reggae drumming; really sets an evil tone.  The song is
about >European expansion and slavery, from an ironic first person stance.
The words cut >like a knife in their poetry - 'We stole them from their
freedom to be sold, To turn >their skins of black into the skins of brightest
gold'.......'We stoked the fires of trade >with human coals' and of course
the lesson/punch line, 'Although we held the whip, >you know we were the real
slaves' .  Brrrrr!   When Andy is on, he can be devasting!   >But the real
brilliance to me is using a backdrop of Gregorian chant like vocals,
>exemplifying the church sanctioned evil of European dominace of the new
world, >over the native style drum beats, representing the cultures that were
subjugated >and devestated in the process.  A very clever and damning musical
picture.  It's not >easy to get at first, but when the words sink in, look

>Have I sold you?   :)

>Later, TK

Later still, TeeKay


Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 12:00:14 +0900
From: "John Boudreau" <>
Subject: Oops !
Message-ID: <000101c01fe6$54d41c20$665791d2@johnboud>

I said these words were from The Kinks tune " Everybody's
In Showbiz " :

" You could cover him with garbage , but George Sanders would still have
style ... " ... Actually , the name of that tune is Celluloid Heroes .



Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 13:58:00 -0400
From: Sylvan <>
Subject: Wasp Star Bashing
Message-ID: <>
Organization: ttp://

> XTC content.....I like AV1 better than Wasp Star. Any takers?

Have to agree with you there. I'll probably be tarred and feathered for
this, but Wasp Star is actually my least favorite XTC album at the
moment. (At least, it's the one that I least often have the urge to play.)
The only song on it that I really love is The Wheel & the Maypole. The
album is electric, but it just doesn't have that spastic energy that
powered their first few albums. Probably the previous album it most
resembles is The Big Express, which is incidentally one of my favorites,
probably because it was their most mature album yet at that point but
still had remnants of that energy.

"The hamster is still dead." --Leonard Nimoy


Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 12:08:37 -0600
From: "Joseph Easter" <>
Subject: if you were in my movie
Message-ID: <001901c02009$236fd520$db821c3f@default>

Soundtrack faves? I thought you'd never ask...

But first, a word for our sponsor.

AV1 is a vastly superior album to WS and it's not really worth explaining.
They are both good, but AV1 is grand. I don't know who said so, but it
doesn't need to be elaborated on.

And now, on with the show...

Fight Club- Dust Brothers
Red - Z. Preisner
Out of Africa (the cats love it, they think they're lions.)
Endurance - John Powell
The Professional - Eric Serra

That's it for scores, for tunes...

Natural Born Killers
Highway 61
When Harry Met Sally
Real Genius (a couple of tracks I can't do w/o; I have a burned illegal
A Life Less Ordinary

When they make the movie about me, xtc will most likely be muerto. So, I'll
probably have one of the Iglesias kids do it. After all, how many are there?

Joseph Easter


Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 13:38:51 EDT
Subject: Re: "Bonus" Tracks
Message-ID: <>

Rory an interesting point in an ocean of controversy...

> Look at *Black Sea*. Where are you going to place the
> three bonus cuts?
> Before "Respectable Street"? You must be insane.
> After the piss-in-the-shower finale of "Travels In
> Nihilon"? You must be mad.
>  Right before "Towers of London," so the clanks will
>  rouse you after "The Somnambulist" nods you off? Now
>  you're talking.

Good point, it sure would spoil the ending of each---but with say, a 30 - 40
second gap it might be acceptable (the time it usually takes a CD changer to
go to the next disc) Black Sea was the first Xtc purchase for me on vinyl so
I kind of see the point you're making. I always felt, though, that songs like
Blame the Weather, Heaven is Paved with Broken Glass and Tissue Tigers should
be added to a new, expanded English Settlement with outtakes (not that it'll
happen in our lifetime).

from Ed-
Actually, this Foreigner thing has reminded me of something; one of my most
all-time detested sounds is the "80s sax part", of which there is a perfect
example on "Urgent". Other examples by various other artists include "the
Heat is On", "Harden My Heart" and "Careless Whispers". I had a wonderful
time in the 80s, and there was some great music, but that sax sound seemed
omnipresent in a lot of mainstream pop of that time,

You're right--the sax was suddenly in vogue for awhile after a long period of
exile. I still love Junior Walker (the sax player on Urgent if I'm not
mistaken). Let's not forget that those sythe textures on 4 were courtesy of
Thomas Dolby as well---so at least Mick Jones had taste even if he was the
"shitty Mick Jones".

Sarah (not plain but perhaps tall...) said-
> OK, I agree, NOTHING is as good as the Simpsons. However being an
unnecessarily big fan of both shows,

I'm partial to quite a few shows on the Cartoon Network. Powerpuff Girls is
easily the equal of the Simpsons and I can watch with my kids (same with
Dexter's Lab...).

Oh well...Just purchased the import version of The Hopple--remastering has
improved the sound but not all the songs. A pity they haven't redone Mott.
Any word about HDCD (or 24 bit versions, etc.) of AV1 or WS?

Speaking of 24 bit...Capitol did a bit too little with their recent Badfinger
best of anthology. While the sound is nice (well, what wouldn't be compared
to the original Apple CDs? I much prefer the DCC discs...), they could have
shown a little imagination in the song selection or, at the very least, add a
second disc of rarties. Who is this disc targeted for? Most fans have this
stuff and the casual fan is not going to care one way or the other if the
sound has been improved.

Oh, and isn't Capitol part of Virgin (or vice versa) now?



Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 18:10:19 EDT
Subject: I'm the man who uttered pie trap
Message-ID: <>


I could've said "cake hole" but I opted for the lesser known "pie trap."
So...and I posted this info, AGAIN, not more than two or three digests

Hey, Paul Culn@ne (SP?) drop me a line please and we'll complete what we
began oh so long ago.




Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 15:40:19 -0700
From: "Bob Claster" <>
Subject: RE: True Confession: Misheard Lyrics
Message-ID: <>

>"Hi, my name is Amy, and I mishear lyrics"
>"Hi, Amy!" [warm applause]

I would think that a meeting of Mishearers Anonymous would go more like

"Hi, my name is Amy, and I mishear lyrics"
"Hi, Andy!" [warm applause]

Bob Claster

S 3`3 Su,'',uS 3`3 Su,'',uS 3`3 Su,'',uS 3`3 Su,'',uS 3`3 Su


Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 17:57:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tyler Hewitt <>
Subject: (insert subject here)
Message-ID: <>

XTC content.....I like AV1 better than Wasp Star. Any

I'll second that. Like Wasp Star just fine, but AV1 is
a high point in the career of XTC. It's right at the
top of the top of their work, I'd rate it with English
Settlement and Skylarking as being the best they've


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 00:41:55 EDT
Subject: Re: Empty Garden and other sad songs
Message-ID: <>

In Chalkhills Digest #6-269 Ralph Simpson DeMarco writes:

>> Empty Garden: Elton John (not kidding!) Sad to think that the death of a
 friend is the only way to get a good song out of some folks...

Sorry, but I must come to the defense of Reg.  Give a listen to Tumbleweed
Connection (from which "Talking Old Soldiers" came from, earlier alluded to
in this category).  You could throw in "My Father's Gun" from that too.
Madman Across the Water is a great LP (CD, whatever) also, ain't a bad song
on either IMNSHO.  I like some of his 80's stuff but don't feel it approaches
the level of this era.

Just curious...with his tribute to Princess Di becoming the most-sold single
in history, is this viewed in the UK as a genuine tribute or syrupy shlock
intended to capitalize on this tragedy?


now playing:  "Everything You Want", the immensely catchy, non-seminal
Vertical Horizon CD


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 00:19:27 -0400
From: Sylvan <>
Subject: eBay Randomness
Message-ID: <>
Organization: ttp://

  I've just taken a visit to eBay, where a search for 'XTC' revealed
many wondrous and rare items such as 'Druns & Wires' and the infamous
'Ornages & Lemons'. There's also a whole lot of lingerie, and for less
obvious reasons, used bicycles, diving computers, and 'Waterproof Foam
Baffles'. For the true completist, there is an Israeli version of
English Settlement. There's also a copy of the Stupidly Happy radio
single going for $14.73. (So the legend is true...) The CD design is the
same as for Wasp Star but tweaked into a happy face.
  Well, that's enough rambling for today.

"The hamster is still dead." --Leonard Nimoy


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 16:23:45 +0000
From: The Worrier Queen <>
Subject: more mummery
Message-ID: <>

Ryan "the Hamster from the Ministry" Anthony wrote

> Listen up, you youngsters on the list. Back before the
> glacier retreated, when you actually had to stand up
> and take a couple of steps if you wanted to change the
> TV channel, there were things called LPs: vinyl discs
> carved on each side with one enormously long spiral
> groove that, depending on how it was cut, would make a
> diamond needle vibrate in such a way that Yma Sumac or
> Mojo Nixon or XTC would come out of your loudspeakers.

Yep I'm getting old - I haven't hidden mine, but then no kids-

I suppose the best way for Virgin to have handled this ( in a
perfect world of course) is to have Mummer in it's original
form & a 2nd CD with the extra tracks.

Still I'm told that these new computer things can make copies and
even allow you to change the order of tracks. Personally I'm
not so sure about that.

"Heeresnachrichtendienst ist ein Widerspruch in den Bezeichnungen."
 - Karl Marx

translation please Iain

I'm currently in a state of shock - just heard an appalling version of
Genesis's Follow you Follow me.
Now I agree it ain't the greatest Genesis track, but I like it.
And then  -
Don't get me started-

Rain in pop music?
I can't stand the rain (can think not of artist)
Here comes the rain again - Eurythmics
Raining men  (I wish)  - The Weathergirls  (& if that happens over the
Church of Women-)
more to follow.

Jayne the Worrier Queen and One of the Three

He Toi Whakairo He Mana Tangata
Where there is artistic excellence, there is human dignity.
Maori saying


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 13:09:47 GMT
From: "Duncan Kimball" <>
Subject: The Big Flame-Off
Message-ID: <>


OK ... so ... what did everyone think of The Opening Ceremony? Did we do

Luckily there were very few hitches, and although the mechanical problems
with the cauldron almost stuffed up the climax of the show, they managed to
fix it quickly and inconspicuously (thank Ozzy for that waterfall) and Cathy
Freeman gets extra credit for maintaining admirable composure thoughout. The
only real blooper was our poor old Governor-General, William Dean who nearly
fluffed his lines and then clobbered the microphone in an attempt to make an
expansive gesture. Poor bugger. Imagine having you attack of nerves captured
for posterity and broadcast to several hundred million people?

Although I had been preparing for a cringe-fest of epic proportions, there
were only a couple of moments that had me reaching for the sick bag.
Obviously the kangaroos-on-bikes silliness in '96 at Atlanta was Ric Birch
throwing us a red herring. Phew!

Frankly, James Morrison's alleged "jazz" fanfare really stunk up the joint
-- the one sour note (well several, actually) in the entire show. Always
hated that guy anyway. The dancing lawnmowers thing was also a bit dicky,
but overall even this hardened cynic was generally pleased and mightily
relieved; in particular, the inclusion of the Aboriginal elements was done
with taste, flair and reasonable respect.

And what did people think of the singers? Farnsey and Libby did their bit
well, as one would expect from such seasoned troupers; Tina Arena (a
stupendously good singer who is capable of SO much more) was let down
somewhat by mediocre material and a shocker of a frock (evidently another
fine creation from Mariah Carey's  boutique of choice, Maison de Tramp) but
I would have to say that Vanessa Amarosi pretty much stole the show,

* * *

Thanks, Jill Oleson. I can now go to the grave knowing that in some small
way my name will live on -- at least on Chaklhills -- as an byword for long,
tedious, rambling posts. Sing hosannas!

* * *

Sympathies to our Pommie cousins who are suffering the effects of the UK
petrol 'shortage' (and we *do* understand - petrol prices have almost
doubled here in the last few months). Maybe now a few more people will start
realising why we've been blathering on all this time about improving public
transport, instead of closing railway lines, tearing up tracks and diverting
billions into building freeways we can now scarcely  afford to drive on.

* * *

More Sad Songs (well, everyone else is doing it)

- "Dark Globe", Syd Barrett  (from "THE MADCAP LAUGHS") - heartrending
autobiographical account of a great talent disintegrating before its own

- "Brick" - Ben Folds Five.

- "Goodnight" - The Beatles

* * *

Some fave soundtracks:
- '2001' (of course)
- 'The Secret of Roan Inish'
- 'Toy Story' (like I have any choice, with 2 kids under six)
- 'Forbidden Planet' (groundbreaking, and nearly 50 years on there's still
nothing quite like it)
- 'Quintet' (Robert Altman, 1975) never seen it on record, but maybe one day

* * *

Jennifer Geese - I sympathise with the problem of having to attend a concert
on your own (and I guess there are other gender-related issues involved
there) but my god, girl, we *are* talking about Ben Folds Five here. What
were you thinking?? I went on my own the first time they toured Australia.
My silly wife has regretted it ever since. Hey, she had her chance and she
blew it. I had a ball. One of the most enjoyable concerts I've ever been to.

* * *

Possible new thread? "Music you never expected Dad/Mum would like".

This was suggested by an incident that happened to me earlier this year. My
dad, a fairly typical '70s parent,  spent most of my teen years reciting the
conventional Generation Gap mantras -- "You call that music? That's not
music!", "Look at that long-haired animal!" "Turn that bloody jungle music
down" "They're all a bunch of druggists" etc etc. The fact that my earliest
music exposures were relatively MOR offerings like Elton John and Cat
Stevens (I know, I know) gives you some idea of how conservative their
tastes are. Needless to say the shit really hit the fan when I discovered
stuff like Lou Reed and Led Zeppelin.

Anyway, the folks dropped in a few months ago and Pa started going on
vaguely about some "negro bloke" he had heard me playing the last time he
had called in. Eventually I managed to figure out that he was talking about
Muddy Waters' version of "Mannish Boy" from "The Last Waltz". Having dad
express ANY positive interest in my music was incredible enough. The fact
that the paterfamilias (who is not generally known for his open-minded
approach to multiculturalism) was saying that he liked a blues by Muddy
Waters was nothing short of astounding.

* * *

Pardon me getting TOTALLY anal about the Kraftwerk thing -- and I will
gladly stand corrected by those (like Jeffery Thomas, who obviously have a
far better working knowledge --  but I believe Ralph and Florian actually
wrote it as "Fahr'n fahr'n fahr'n auf der autobahn". That is, a slight
contraction of "fahren" (to drive). which allows the line to flow better,
since 'fahren' is a two-syllable word and singing "fahr-en" would stuff up
the scancion. [Need to know value = 0]

Yours volubly,

Duncan "loquacious is not a variety of fruit" Kimball

"DRUG (noun) - any substance which, when injected into an albino rat,
produces a scientific paper."
                                               Dr Dale Atrens


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 10:08:41 EDT
Subject: A taker
Message-ID: <>

Sarah D. typed:

XTC content.....I like AV1 better than Wasp Star. Any takers?

Not that I want to start a stupid back & forth thing but... I cannot stop
listening to Wasp Star. I just can't. Dont get me wrong ,I love AV1 but  I
actually skip over some songs to hear others. On WS, I cant wait for each
song. I love every one of them. It will completely amaze me if AV1 out-sells

Now, on to Family Guy..... If anyone saw the episode where the father went
away to a womens retreat, do you remember what his bumper sticker read on the
back of his car?  I laughed for 2 days straight.
 And on a sad note, It was 41 degrees this morning. UGH!!
p.s.  Molly, you can change your name, just dont change your posts.
n.p. Wasp Star


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 13:01:58 -0400
From: Jeff Eason <>
Subject: Here comes Vernal Equinox!
Message-ID: <>

Howdy All,

Had to throw my hat into the ring on all these wonderful threads.
On the misheard lyric thread: Jen Geese's story about Jimmy Buffet and the
golf imagery made me laugh out loud! Good one, Jen.
Like Kirk, I too misheard the French line "Jeux sans frontiers" on Peter
Gabriel's "Games Without Frontiers". I thought they were saying "she's so
thought-delayed", which to this day I think would make a good lyric.
On the Tubes first album there is a song called "Boy Crazy" about--you
guessed it--one of those girls whose reputation is ruined by an overactive
libido. There's a repeated line in the song that goes, "The rumour went
around". I always thought they were saying, "She threw my weight around", a
line that went perfectly with the theme of the song.

The Saddest Song theme has really shaped up nicely with more attention
given to obscure songs by the likes of sad song masters Richard Thompson
and Randy Newman. For my money, Thompson's the king. Songs like "Withered
and Died" and "Down Where the Drunkards Roll" are just heartbreaking. I
particularly like the Los Lobos version of "Drunkdards Roll" on the
Thompson Tribute lp "Beat the Retreat". Tribute albums tend to be hit and
miss depending on the song and the artist but "Beat the Retreat" is stellar

Other Sad Songs:
Biff Rose--Molly
Kelly Hogan--King Me
Tom Waits--A Little Rain
Beacon Hillbillies--Cold Light of Dawn
Laura Nyro--Stoney End
Todd Rundgren--The Last Ride
Whiskeytown--Houses on the Hill
Geraldine Fibbers--Trashman in Furs

Speaking of Randy Newman (honest, I was. Just scroll up, you'll see), Harry
Nilsson's classic album "Nilsson Sings Newman" has just been re-released
with added tracks. Harry's version of Randy's "So Long Dad" deserves a spot
on the sad song list. The whole album is fantastic and the sound is state
of the art, even for today (it was originally recorded in the late 60s).

Sorry 'bout the lack of XTC content!

Jeff "I seem to be a verb" Eason


Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 20:27:46 +0200
From: "Mark Strijbos" <>
Subject: Bonus Onus
Message-ID: <>

Dear Chalkers,

> Look at *Black Sea*. Where are you going to place the
> three bonus cuts?

mmm... a bonus disc perhaps?

But most certainly _not_ in the middle of an album.
Sure, there has always been a delay between sides A and B and of
course artists were aware of this, and kept this in mind when they
compiled the tracklisting. There still is a sense of continuity and
togetherness between the sides, purposely planned

The worst possible example in our case must be Mummer.
The Homo Safari instrumentals, however charming they may be,
very clearly do not belong there and stick out like a sore thumb

In other words: NLIOL should be followed by Towers Of London;
that's how the album was conceived by the artists. In my humble
opinion one should never tamper with a work of art.

yours in xtc,

Mark S. @ the Little Lighthouse


End of Chalkhills Digest #6-270

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