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Subject: Chalkhills Digest #5-186


         Chalkhills Digest, Volume 5, Number 186

                 Thursday, 29 April 1999

Today's Topics:

                    Behind Her Bonnet
              Darn...No Dame Fortune on AV2
                    Spaghetti Junction
                In London there is also...
                Re: Nonsuch Sucks? No Way!
                    Coucou le revoilou
                       Other Albums
                     Partridge Power
                 Re: Bloody Boys In Blue
                        matt kaden
          Gregsy's business with the other Two?
                   Re: The Last Hurrah
                Re: Are You Being Served?
                    Re: An observation
                   Re: Little Boy Blue
               Tabla and the Time Passages!
                     TV's glory days

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I don't want to let love spoil the day again.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 28 Apr 99 09:45:33 AES
From: Paul.Culnane@dcita.gov.au
Subject: Behind Her Bonnet
Message-ID: <0000amouaaum.0000zvlvrdtv@dcita.gov.au>

There seems to be some kind of artwork behind the disc tray on the Easter
Theatre digipak.  Has anybody taken the plunge to steam the plastic tray
off to find out what's underneath?  Or does anybody know what's underneath
anyway?  Obviously, I don't want to risk finding out with my copy!

~p@ul

------------------------------

From: WWi8064839@aol.com
Message-ID: <700f86ee.2457b2fa@aol.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 20:40:26 EDT
Subject: Darn...No Dame Fortune on AV2

I was just looking at the Chalkhills discography. It's a shame that "Dame
Fortune" isn't slated to be on AV, Volume 2. A great track! One of Andy's
best demos. Oh well. Yes, melt the guns. All of them!

Wes Wilson
(blissfully listening to the new Bunnymen album...:-) )

------------------------------

Message-ID: <37265F9D.9ABDBE0B@zoo.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:08:48 +0100
From: John Peacock <johndrewp@zoo.co.uk>
Subject: Spaghetti Junction

John Gardner wrote:

> So for me, no amount of american roundabouts, which there are quite a
> few, and many in the suburbs of Chicago, believe it or not, can frustrate
> me, CUZ I SURVIVED THE SPAGHETTI ROUNDABOUT!

Or more properly, Spaghetti Junction.

I imagine the designers of that thing stayed up very very late,
giggling.

"Go on, Derek, put another bit on, I dare you."

So he does, and they all collapse in peals of laughter, pledging to only
take the train to Birmingham, or better yet avoid the Midlands
altogether.

And there's always the fear that you might stray onto a bit that has
entrances, but no exits, and spend the rest of your life just going
round and round and round and...

Of course, as a non-driving passenger I can have these cheerful
thoughts, and express them freely while the driver is trying to work out
where the hell the exit is.

J

------------------------------

Message-ID: <19990428004345.25284.rocketmail@web1.rocketmail.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:43:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cheryl <cxtc@rocketmail.com>
Subject: In London there is also...

Hey there

Our dearly beloved Richard P-A recounted:

>In London there is also a Green Dragon, Dog &
>Dumplings, Moon Under Water, Spread Eagle, Flower
>Pot, Perseverance, Case Is Altered, Seven Balls,
>Bitter Experience, Charcoal Burner, Old Shades,
>Surprise, Pied Bull, Newt & Ferret, Bun Shop and
>Monkey Puzzle... and hopefully that exhausts any
>"Whacky Pub Name" thread but certainly could inspire
>for band names

OH! Wait! Wait! You forgot my favourite, Pig And
Whistle,  and in Swindon there is the Hobgoblin too,
which I wanted to take a peek in just because of the
name.

Sorry, just had to throw those two in there.

Take care everyone,
Cheryl
6 days and counting...

------------------------------

From: "Kerry Chicoine" <KERRY-N-MARV@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Nonsuch Sucks? No Way!
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 20:08:07 -0500
Message-ID: <01be9113$9399f820$LocalHost@default>

pq ribber wrote:

>At least, I say, it didnt outright suck, like Nonesuch, which, to this
>day, I am sad to have to admit, I play periodically, trying to find
>SOMETHING I like, and fail.

Oomph! I feel like I've been punched in the stomach! My dear sweet fellow
human, what is there *not* to like about a polished gemstone such as 'Humble
Daisy'? It's Andy's all time best song IMO! Although I really love its
earlier counterpart 'Ladybird' from the Mummer album.

OMBEAN1@aol.com wrote:

>Someone mentioned " I Cant Own Her" as a low point  of AV1. WHAT? Listen
again.

Exactly! I'm not kidding, I *cried* like a big fat baby for the first 25
times I heard that song. I think 'I Can't Own Her' is a landmark recording,
one that raises the pop possibilities higher than heaven itself! It's a
fantastic song and one I'll be aspiring to emulate for as long as I
continue to write...

Lemon curry?

KK

------------------------------

From: fsolans@carat.fr
Message-ID: <80256761.0030BBD3.00@lns019.carat.fr>
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:10:32 +0100
Subject: Coucou le revoilou

Salut

a tous, Chalkeurs
and bad luck for you all proud defenders of Mother Grammar : after a lurker
time, the English Language murderer is back !
Well.
AV1 is a two months baby now, and it grows up very well, thank you. At
least one listening per day at work, and not a boring second : without any
doubt, it's an XTC record.
Now my religion is done : never more the demos before the release. With the
seven years, it was ok for this time, but I want to come back to the real
hurricane of a virgin d-day. XTC's work deserves that. The real AV1's shock
occured to me three years ago, when ROO stuck me to the ceiling, when KISK
and ET gave me tears and lump in my throat, when GM burnt my brain.
Feelings at the release were also strong, but without comparison and mainly
due to the three songs not already known (HF, my fave, and Colin's).
Honestly, if I had a preference for few of the demos immediatly after the
first CD listening (only details), it's not the case now. When I'm
listening the demos today, it's seems to me far from the perfection of AV1.
And I think waiting it's a better proof of respect for an artistic work,
wait it in its definitive form, exactly like the author want to deliver it.
I believe that Andy is always angry with our pre-listening coming from
diverse source, and I'm completely understanding him. If you have any cre
ative activity or if you know people who have, you will meet very few of
them who like to show their rough-works before the complete. It's different
when you are a close friend, but in this case, I'm very far to be an XTC's
close friend, so I will wait the real stuff and I have all the time to
listen the demos after.
Those who disagree can kill me now, j'ecris l'anglais en le burinant a la
serpe ce qui me laisse peu de moyens de reparties. Cela dit, n'entravant
que pouic quand ca se corse, ca me fait le dos large en matiere
d'amour-propre ecorche, so come on folks !

Some news from around here. According to Musidisc (french distributor for
CV), AV1 already sold more than 14.000 copies, which is the top score for
an XTC record in this country. Excellent trend. But as usual, very rare
airplay. After some articles and media celebration around the release date,
XTC is back to anonymity. ET single isn't release here (v'got an import and
it's a funny thing). For all french spoken, Arsenic et Vieilles Querelles
is at last avalaible, it's a mavelous miracle. My friend Philippe Bihan
fills all our fan's hearts with his amazing job. In spite of ridiculous
meanings, the book looks wonderful, great story, great learnings, a real
fan must have that in his hands at least one time in his life. Philippe has
taken an half-hour on main national station France Inter, invited by
Bernard Lenoir (our national John Peel, and huge fan) to present his book.
It was positively an exquisite moment. Only three songs in 30 minuts, cause
the men discuss a lot and time was quickly overpassed (here we're
 all knowing that long nights and passionated days are requested to speak
correctly about XTC...but this is not exactly the national station POV !).
So it was thirty minuts, not one more, ...but each was great. Maybe ones of
the hundred young ears listening will take their ticket for XTCland after
that (hope).

Sgt Pepper ? at the begining, no interest. Then it was a good time to take
a look back.
I'm a last child, with big backgrounds from parents - Georges Brassens,
Django, Louis Amstrong, Nat King Cole (spanish era) Frederic (yes, it's
why) Chopin.... - from my sister six years old more - Beatles, Bowie, Simon
& Garfunkel, Neil Young....- and finaly from my brother three years old
more, all that mixed in the household sound machines. My broz introduced me
in my two teen engagements, apparently opposite : Genesis first, with
Trespass, and all their stuff where the Lamb culminated (and Yes, and
Jethro Tull, and ....), The Stranglers years later, with The Raven (and
XTC, and Clash, and Talking Heads....). From this time, early 80's, I made
my own background, most of the time on the same line with my broz. All
along, XTC was permanently first of all.
I met reggae with Sandinista, and Marley and LKJ and.....
I met only two real Top Band from the rock area the ten last years, Pixies
and Radiohead, more hundred bands for the airplay and lot of feelings. I
met musics from all around the world, groovy things, amazing sounds, others
feelings.
And finaly, from the begining to now, there is no opposite : strong voices,
strong players, strong styles, strong rhytms, dedicated to melodies and
dissonances.
til the end, it will be my formula.

Well, enough.
(pour ceux qui n'arrivent pas a digerer la bouillie, evitez-moi la
prochaine fois)

Fredo Fat Bassman

What ? a third GEGGY TAH soon ? well, with Fuzzy Warbles, kind of thing
will feed me
waiting for AV2

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.32.19990428091227.00dd6680@cam-mail1.cambridge.arm.com>
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:12:29 +0100
From: Adam Parsons <Adam.Parsons@arm.com>
Subject: Other Albums

Hi all,

I've been lurking for a while, and now feel I could make a (trivial)
contribution to the list.

Regarding the 'No Thugs....' discussion, the 'boy in blue' is definitely a
policeman. When people started on about it being his brother, I thought I'd
missed something deep and obscure - now I'm convinced it's just the regular
use of a very common English expression!

Have any XTC/ex-XTC members done any solo albums? I'd be interested in
trying to get hold of any of their other work. I have 'Chips From the
Chocolate Fireball', so know about the Dukes, and I've got The Colonel's
'Too Many Cooks in the Kitchen' single - was there ever an album from him?

Any other details would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Adam.

------------------------------

From: "Nigel Doran" <n.doran@farn-ct.ac.uk>
Organization: Farnborough College of Technology
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:23:47 GMT+0
Subject: Partridge Power
Message-ID: <1389E665EB5@library.farn-ct.ac.uk>

Dear Chalkers

Just an example of how the songs of Mr. Partridge can have an
effect on the subconscious.

I'd liked a girl for ages, but was getting nowhere slowly. Then on
my nightly walk to the pub where we both drink, I stuck an XTC
compilation I made into my walkman. Terry's funky drumming on
SGT. Rock took me in, and hypnotised me. I ended up playing it 5
times, every night for a week, and the line' Sgt.Rock is going to
help me. Make the girl mine...' stuck in my head.

With the good seargent holding my hand, I made my move, and it
worked! Cheers Andy, youre an inspiration.

Have any other fans had any life enhancing experiences because of
an XTC track

Cheers
Nigel D

'Do what you will but harm none'

------------------------------

From: "Andy" <Plysadh@nottingham.ac.uk>
Organization: The University of Nottingham
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:05:01 GMT0BST
Subject: Re: Bloody Boys In Blue
Message-Id: <E10cT5Z-00033H-00@nottingham.ac.uk>

Please listen to Dom, the overwhelming concensus amongst us
englishfolk should have convinced you by now. Besides, Andy calls the
policeman boy because that is the expression, whether you like it or
not - "boys in blue". Why the bloody hell does graham need a younger
brother anyway, what part in the plot could he play?

Andy

------------------------------

Message-ID: <19990428123630.93002.qmail@hotmail.com>
From: "jonathan monnickendam" <monnickj@hotmail.com>
Subject: matt kaden
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 05:36:30 PDT

Has anybody have a current e-mail address for this man ? I just
wanted to get in touch.

appreciated

jon

------------------------------

From: Chauncy14@aol.com
Message-ID: <fbf47795.24586a8b@aol.com>
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:43:39 EDT
Subject: Gregsy's business with the other Two?

Hey XTC Cllan ~

<Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 13:11:40 -0500
From: Mitch Friedman <mitchf@mindspring.com>
Subject: new Dave news>

Wrote in regards to a letter from Dave:

<"Another busy week ahead - two more days at the Townhouse Studios with
Miss Finland (well *someone's* gotta do it) - then business to conclude
with The Other Two Guys.">

If you don't mind me asking, what is the *business* Dave refers herein, to
conclude?

John Gardner
Chicago

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 02:22:01 -0400
Subject: Re: The Last Hurrah
Message-ID: <19990428.022229.15838.1.BrainiacsDaughter@juno.com>
From: Elizabeth I Spencer <brainiacsdaughter@juno.com>

Er, well Pacific 707--how do I put this???

I don't know if you're the *only* one, but I'm sure few of us believe AV1
to be the band's "last hurrah." Though I had a bit of a hard time with
the disc intially, I've come to see and hear it for what it is. And what
it is, is gorgeous. Mr. P. has always talked about pushing out at the
edges of the pop balloon, (without actually popping it,) and isn't that
one of the biggest reasons we love what he does? If we never got anything
but Black Sea Redux, we never would have had Snow Man, or Me and the
Wind, or 1000 Umbrellas, or well......you name it. Digging this band is
about digging growth. And that means respecting the changes in the band,
because on some level we understand and connect with it. When they
change, we're invited along for the ride. And, oh Gawd, am I glad I said
yes!

Come on. Andy's got kids. I'm sure the white pants with the arrows don't
fit him anymore. Give the disc an honest listen. I swear, the
maniac-genius you know and love is still right there.

Liz Spencer

------------------------------

Message-ID: <19990428153518.78527.qmail@hotmail.com>
From: "Megan Heller" <hellerm@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Are You Being Served?
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:35:18 PDT

[No XTC content, but at least this means I won't be arguing about "No
Thugs in Our House"] [I always thought it was very obvious that it was
a policeman, and I'm American and was twelve when I bought the album]

Many moons ago, (I believe) Huw Davies asked--
>BTW Why do Americans like Are You Being Served so much? To me it
>represents all that is bad about British TV.

I actually brought up this discussion in my class on Theoretical
Approaches to Literary and Cultural Studies (say that five times fast)
yesterday.  We read an article by John Fiske called "the Popular
Economy," which talked about why certain shows are popular in certain
cultures, especially homogeneous shows.  On of his examples was the
show "Dallas," which, in its day, was one of the most popular shows in
the world.  Now, it's easy (and very Frankfurt School) to say that
it's just a matter of people being dupes to the system.  Fiske, and
other ethnographers, argues that it has more to do with what is
brought to the show by a particular culture-- for example, a study
showed that there were Marxists who liked "Dallas" because they
believed that the show was actually subversive, mocking the captialism
it seemed to celebrate.  We started talking about the fact that
Americans seem to think that everything that comes out of Britain is
cultured and intelligent.  This means every British comedy is
"clever," including "Are You Being Served?".  (We also discussed the
fascination with every period film that comes out of Britain, but
that's another matter.)  On the other hand, some other students who
has been to England for a period of time noticed that violence and
stupidity seemed to be associated with the United States.  For
example, one girl mentioned watching a play in London called
"Popcorn," which depicted Tarantino-style violence and American
characters (over here, an American playing a Brit is usually playing a
"cultured" character).  My roommate lived in England for a while, and
she mentioned hearing a radio ad for a British product in which the
speaker was supposed to be a bit backward, and the accent used was
distinctly American (leaning towards Texan).

SO...do Americans just think the English are smarter (despite Benny
Hill and the Teletubbies)?  Do the British think Americans are violent
and stupid (and are they right)?  I'd be interested in hearing views
on this matter, especially in media terms.

megan.

------------------------------

Message-ID: <A5JVlTA$UiJ3IwXr@coopefamily.demon.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 21:59:43 +0100
From: KT <Katy@coopefamily.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: An observation

In article <19990424.040229.3486.1.MollyFa@juno.com>, mollyfa@juno.com
writes
>Well, I just found an old tape I taped off of MTV (when it was still
>cool), and I found Dear God.  I was watching, and I noticed something
>that I've never noticed before.  The scene where Andy sings, "And the
>devil too", and he's playing with his fingers, I never noticed that he
>was in the tree.  I had to go back and rewatch it to see if I was right.
>He looks so evil when he says that.  =o)

Yeah, I saw that (although on a crap tape >.<) That is the main reson
why I like that vidio so much, we're talking even more evil looking that
robbie williams..
 me like n.n
oh, BTW, like dom said, A BOY IN BLUE IS A POLICEMAN!!
--
KT Coope

------------------------------

Message-ID: <NJdWpWAsYiJ3IwV6@coopefamily.demon.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 22:03:40 +0100
From: KT <Katy@coopefamily.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Little Boy Blue

In article <199904271645.JAA49371@mando.engr.sgi.com>, owner-
<chalkhills@chalkhills.org> writes
>> I think that "boy in blue" actually refers to the policeman, so
>> there would only be *one* son. I think this may be another of those
>> uniquely British phrases that has caused some confusion.
>
>Policemen wear blue here too, although they aren't called "boys".

yeah, bear in mind it is the WHOLE TERM boy in blue, that means
Policeman

>Do you say "cop" in Britain?  That seems like a very American word to
>me.

Yeah, but only coz I'm a 'orrible teeanger. i've hear english policemen
get rally pissed off if you call them cops though..though they get
called coppers..
 er..I'll shut up now.
--
Katy Coope

------------------------------

From: Chauncy14@aol.com
Message-ID: <1f5fb694.2458b14f@aol.com>
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:45:35 EDT
Subject: Tabla and the Time Passages!

Hey XTC Clan ~

<From: dieling <lemoncurry@geocities.com
Subject: Rhythmic peppers>
>From Digest #5-155...

Dated: Wednesday, 31 March 1999

Speculated:

<Any Tabla players out there who don't get lost in 17/39 rhythms?>

Mr. Lemon Curry ~

I have searched for weeks to find this reference you made, and I found it!

Just a few comments:

Re: getting lost in 17/39 rhythms...there is of course no such thing!

Time Signatures are only divisible or a multiple of the numbers 2 or 3, on
the upper number of the signature, which shows the number of beats.  The
bottom number is only divisible or a multiple of the number 2.

Therefore, since 17 and 39 are prime numbers, and can only be divisible by
themselves or the number 1, they are not a part of the time signature.
Unless you were joking, that is the fact Jack!

As for the Tabla, the rhythms are considered to be a *raga.* The actual
instrument used in conjunction with a *sitar,* is the *tabla* or hand drum.
These instruments, for those who aren't familiar with them, are most
commonly used in India.

In general, while listening to music from India, you usually hear the
sitar, which is a stringed instrument, being played melodically, while a
series of syncopated cross-rhythms is being played by a musician on a
tabla.

The drum rhythms are based on rhythmic units known as *talas.* A *tala* is
a drum rhythm framework on which one or more drummers can improvise.  This
is a *layering* effect, on which there is one basic drum pattern, with
additional layers of more drum patterns on top of the central theme
pattern.

The Grateful Deads' drummers did their drum solos on tom toms together
based on this rudimentary framework, for example.  Even *Roll away the Dew*
has this twinge.

There really is no connection between the Tabla and XTC's *Greenman,* but
if there where to be one, I would say, that it can be said that they share
a similar pattern or paragraphing.  These patterns are called *ternary.*

This term denotes a three-part musical form created by repeating a first
section, after a contrasting section. A *bridge,* if you will.  And that is
it!  There is no Tabla to speak of on this song....sorry!

Now, maybe Andy and/or Prairie, together slapping their thighs in
rudimentary fashion, is what you are hearing???

This brings up another song, ABACAB, by Genesis.  This is a 6-part binary
ternary.  {I know, its' quite the pun! }

Greenman is a five part binary, and if the keys were A - B - A - C - D, per
part, then this would affectuate the pattern.  When you listen to this
song, ask yourself, *how many movements are there?* These are the simple
structure of the song itself ~ how the song breaks down, down to the chord,
verse and phrasing.  The paragraphing, if you will.

But, I am not certain of the key in which Greenman is played in, therefore,
cannot comment on that.  But Genesis's song *ABACAB* was based on the keys
they were playing therein.  Nothing more!

I would reason that since XTC have had the habit of recording never more
than they could reproduce live, in the early days, many songs in the
catelogue are tunes which have keys that are 3 part, of simple binary
structure, including some on AV1.  Although some of it is clearly along
different lines as stated above, the majority of the music has time
passages which are within a 4/4 time signature.

This of course says nothing about the meter of AV1 songs, and that is a
whole new ballgame!

I hope this helps, unless you were just goofing around!

John Gardner
Chicago

------------------------------

Message-ID: <618F91505D89D21185330001FA6A49548EACB9@HFD-EXCH008>
From: "Witter, Karl F" <WitterKF@aetna.com>
Subject: TV's glory days
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:00:31 -0400

>Why do Brits like "Three's Company" so much?

Baywatch not invented yet, plus continued presence of
Kate Jackson made "Charlie's Angels" too cerebral.

Still watching Supertrain,
Karl

------------------------------

End of Chalkhills Digest #5-186
*******************************

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